For full functionality of this site it is necessary to enable JavaScript. Here are the instructions how to enable JavaScript in your web browser.

Emma + Kurate:

Maximizing Traffic & Revenue with WordPress & Email




Ready to scale your content marketing efforts? Join experts from Emma and Kurate as they teach you:

  • • How to get the right people into your funnel with signup forms

  • • The best ways to nurture leads with well-designed, automated email campaigns

  • • Tips for generating direct revenue from ads on your site and in your marketing emails

Hashtag: #EmmaPlusKurate

Jamie: Hello, everybody. Thank you so much for joining us for today’s presentation. Emma + Kurate: Maximizing Traffic and Revenue with WordPress and Email. But before we get started, I’m going to tell you guys a little housekeeping. So if you’re on the line today, don’t worry, we will send a recording. If you’re not here, you’re not hearing me say this, but you will also get the recording and you can share that with your friends. You can forward it to everyone. So do not worry, it’s coming your way. We’re gonna give a presentation and then we will get to a Q&A. So if you do have questions throughout today’s presentation, be sure to type those directly into the go-to webinar chat modal and we’ll be scooping those up and you know, adding those to the list to address here at the end of today’s presentation. So, all good stuff there and I’ve got a guest. As you see here, it’s Jamie Bradley. I’m Jamie. I’m a content marketing strategist here at Emma and we’re an email marketing company. But I’m here with John Housholder from Kurate.

John: Hey?

Jamie: Hey, John? John is the founder of Kurate and also works for a company called Ah So Design. Correct?

John: That’s correct. We’re a WordPress Development Agency in Nashville.

Jamie: Yeah, we’re based in Nashville as well. So John’s our neighbor and friend. So tell us a little bit more about Kurate. Knowing that also we are gonna get to the end and show you guys lots more details about how to use all these tools together to be successful, but lay it on us, what is Kurate all about?

John: Sure. So, Kurate is a way to automatically send all of your latest post from WordPress to Emma. So, very, very short, sweet and simple.

Jamie: There you go. And that’s exactly what it does. And Emma is, of course, an email marketing platform and we allow you to mix and track automate these processes and we do integrate with lots of amazing partners, John and his team being one of them, so happy to have you here. And, you know, again, we’re gonna look at some specific things that you can do later on with Kurate and Emma.

But first, I think it’s really important to sort of establish why we’re even chatting about WordPress and email in the first place. And that is the simple fact that let me get here, a lot of people are using WordPress, almost 75 million sites out there, depending on WordPress, and the most recent stats are showing that since March of 2016, so about a year ago, WordPress is actually powering 26.4% of the web.

John: Huge.

Jamie: Huge and it’s on the rise. It is on the rise too, believe it or not, it is still by far the most use CMS, it has almost 60% of the market share. And interestingly, on a daily basis, there are over 500 sites being created on WordPress, so I thought that was pretty phenomenal.

John: It’s a good business to be in.

Jamie: Yeah, it seems like you’re making the right moves here, John. So it’s not going anywhere. And it’s probably likely that you either use WordPress yourself if you’re on the line or you’re interested in it. So you’d be in good company, Emma exists because email is an incredibly powerful channel. So it turns out people are spending a ton of time in their inboxes and that’s evidenced by the numbers that you see here. Emma alone powers the email communication of about 15,000 direct customers and about 50,000 when we factor in all of our accounts, you know, that might have multiple clients or tiered account structures or something like that. So tons of people are using Emma and millions of people, billions of people are using email on a daily basis.

And of those clients, the most successful of our clients are seeing numbers like this. So the average ROI for email is about $38 for every $1 spent. To compare that, that’s more than double that of almost every other digital channel. Sort of tit-for-tat here. So the ROI of email is working and not all email is created equal, however. So what types of email actually are seeing these types of returns? Well, we’ll get to that in a second. Because first and foremost, marketers are really, really busy. So you need to send email, you know it’s powerful, you’ve got this great WordPress site, you’re creating content.

John: Wouldn’t it be great if we could automate it?

Jamie: Yes, wouldn’t it. And it’s not only great that we can automate it because we’re busy. It also gets really great results. So it’s kind of a win-win, automated email campaigns account for 21% of email marketing revenue. So of that number, of that high return, the automated campaigns are the ones that are seeing the best results by and large, and the majority of marketers and that sort of top performing category of, you know, email marketers that are seeing great results, they are saying that they are using automation to scale their efforts and most importantly, to get the right information to the right people at the right time.

And that’s important because when you actually send relevant email, you drive 18 times more revenue than when you’re just sending sort of batch and blast broadcast email. And when we talk about relevant email, we mean the frequency of sending it, you know, automating that email. So based on let’s say, I click something or I indicate them in a certain category or group, and then making sure that the content that you’re actually delivering to me is meaningful to me and it’s content that actually matters. All of those things sort of play together to really drive home the power of your website and that email channel in general.

So today, John and I are here and we’re gonna walk you through how WordPress users can really more effectively capture more leads on their site or blog and then we’re going to talk about really what you do with them from there, how you actually automate these processes, scale your efforts because guess what, you’re busy, you ain’t gonna get less busy and yeah, and we’re gonna look at that now. So moving on you cannot send email without people on an email list. So you got to get the right people in the door. How do you do that? Well, set up some forms.

John: How about a pop-up?

Jamie: How about a pop-up form? So, what you’re looking at here this is from…actual a mutual customer of ours a company called Style Blueprint, I mean, maybe you’re familiar with them. How would you describe Style Blueprint?

John: Style Blueprint is a women’s lifestyle blog.

Jamie: Exactly. I like it. They send me lots of recipes, clothes, deals, all that jazz into it. But in order for me to really make the most of my relationship with Style Blueprint and how much I like it, they have an email component and this is the way that they get people on this list. It’s a standard pop-up form. You’re seeing these all over the place and this actually just deploys when I hit this side. I’m hanging out for a few minutes and then they’re simply asking me for my email address and the city or cities that I live in.

And this is just a great example of basically not asking for too much information up front, especially with something like a blog or a lifestyle brand, you know, they’re not giving me anything in return at this touch point. They’re really just seeing if I’m interested. And we’ll look at some examples here in a second of actually creating more of an exchange at this touch point. But these pop-up forms, of course, the reason that they’re popular, the reason that you see them everywhere and the reason that they started outpacing those kind of embedded forms are because they were really effective.

John: Very effective.

Jamie: Very effective. Absolutely, you know, and I remember when they first came out, people were like, “This is annoying.”

John: Annoying.

Janie: Yeah, it’s going to annoy everyone and turns out it really doesn’t prohibit anyone from…for, you know, people didn’t see large drop-offs in their signups. In fact, they saw quite the opposite. So and I know that there are, you know, people do ask questions. There are some sort of some rules and some things you know, I know Google has created an algorithm, you know that in some ways for certain, and I’m not an expert on it, I can penalize certain people when certain types of pop-ups pop-up but there are ways that you can kind of get around that. Do you have a little bit more to tell there.

John: Sure, like just generally speaking the reason why Google doesn’t like pop-ups is that they take you to another site. So like a lot of times you’ll see this especially in your mobile device like click here and then you open it up and it’s an ad for a game or something some mobile game that is gonna take you right to the mobile app store.

Google doesn’t like that because that takes you away from their page. Google makes money when you click on one page’s website over and over again as they’re selling ads.

Jamie: Yes. So, a pop-up like this, you’re perfectly okay.

John: Perfectly okay, Google like.

Jamie: You’re Google like. So, a good one. But we don’t wanna just stop here. There are lots of different types of forms, this is from one of our clients Goldieblox. And what you’re seeing here actually they’re just asking for an email address. They’re also obviously including an offer and it’s proven when you include some type of offer your chances of people filling out this form or even higher, better yet, this form is actually an example. You can’t see it in the screenshot. But this is actually an example of what we would call an exit intent pop-up. And essentially what that means is when I…I’m not sure if you can see my mouse, go over here and hover over the little area to leave the page, it actually deploys the pop-up at that interaction. So it’s tracking my mouse behavior. And it’s saying,” Hey, this person stayed on this page, this copy or whatever we had here wasn’t engaging, let’s try this sort of last-ditch effort to try and get them to sign up.” And these exit intent pop-ups are performing even better than just sort of the time delay pop-up that’s appearing across the board. And this one is actually created with a company called Privy which we also integrate with and I think it’s popular I think with some of your clients as well. So, pretty cool.

And then here we go. So, this is actually…this is a retailer just…Goldieblox is also a retailer, I think Style Blueprint is the publisher of the blog space. These tactics though, these pop-up forms, these are things that are sort of work across the board. These are not necessarily relegated to our friends that are just in the blog world or in the retail world. But turns out a lot of times, bloggers and retailers are on the forefront of what’s trending and what actually works. So, just a fun little side note there.

But I love this one because it is actually an example of a banner-style pop-up and you are going to start seeing these more and more if we’re sort of pop-up trend forecasting, if you will. These banners sell pop-ups now are outperforming just the general light-box pop up which are the examples that we just saw. And that’s because I’m actually able to still scroll and interact with the website behind this form. It doesn’t prohibit me from experiencing a website, but it just obviously keeps this nice real estate there kind of dangling an offer. So it’s that nice kind of one-two punch of you’re drawing me and possibly with your content. And also this offer is there so that on my time, on my schedule as a consumer or as a reader, I can say, you know what, “Now I am ready, yeah, I do want this discount and I want it right now.”

And I love this one too, because they’ve got these two buttons are kind of cheeky. It’s like, “Yes, I wanna save, no, I’d rather pay more.”

John: Everyone wants to pay more for stuff.

Jamie: Right, exactly. So they’re playing some…It’s not even reverse psychology. They’re just sort of taunting me. But they’re…it’s incredibly effective. The other thing that I want to point out about this specific one is that this brand has a women’s line and a men’s line and because I use this banner to enter their list, they actually now serve me content about their women’s clothing line almost exclusively. So they actually segmented me without me even knowing that they did that at this point, which is pretty cool.

John: It’s cool.

Jamie: Yeah, and it’s pretty important.

John: Well done.

Jamie: Yeah, I know, this is a cool brand. So and you know obviously we’ve looked at retail, we’ve looked at blogs but sometimes you just have some you know, maybe you’re a B2B marketer and you’ve got…

John: You kind of wanna do your own. I think a big player in the WordPress space, especially is OptinMonster. OptinMonster has you can build the forms on your own and they have probably about 15 or 20 different things you can do they have the eggs and intent, they have…if you go to our site there’s one on the footer that you can do, they have you know, when you scroll a certain amount on the page one pops up, it pops up after 20 seconds, they have just about everything you can ever think of on their great company. Super easy for you to just…if you’re like a DIY, do it yourself type of person.

Jamie: Yeah, and I think that’s a great thing to point out, you know, these sort of, tactics for growing your list and getting people on, you know, these are things that any marketer can do at any level and at any price point. You know, we have people that will come to us and need crazy custom forms. And, of course, we are willing to do that. But we also will often push people to solutions like this, where if you can do it yourself, if you want to do it yourself, you’re more than happy or we’re more than happy to sort of point you in that direction.

And I love this example too because they are essentially you know, and we’re gonna get to sort of content and customization and relevancy with the content specifically here in a moment. But what I love about this is there’s no better way as someone who is publishing content than to offer that right out of the gate. So in order to get me in, you don’t always have to give me something of you know, give me a discount. You can actually just show me why I should care about your brand in a deeper way.

And again, they’re only asking for, you know, name, email. And I love that the call to action too isn’t a sign up for our list it’s actually download now because I’m getting something obviously I’m also signing into the list. But if they’re mindful, if you know, this brand is mindful with me that I’m you know, I’m interested in this type of content, hopefully, they’re going to keep serving me similar types of content about website conversions. So, it’s just a really good example here. And lastly, you know, I did mention sort of custom forms that we built for people this is an exit intent form. And, you know, this is the Convention and Visitors Bureau of Philadelphia when they came to us, they actually had a, you know, they didn’t even have a pop-up form, they had an embedded form kind of, I think it was buried somewhere on the bottom of their website. And just by simply implementing this pop-up that, again, is just asking for an email address.

John: I wonder if it works. Does it work?

Jamie: Let’s see and when…

John: I would say that worked.

Jamie: Yeah. So in one year, they gained about 62,000 new subscribers. And we show that number because, you know, they had some continual list growth, but just with implementing that pop-up they saw an insane amount of engagement and they actually see about 1,000 new subscribers a month. So if I haven’t made the case for pop-ups and being thoughtful about that sort of interaction, I don’t know what else to do, because it really is super effective. So, you know, we talked about getting people on the list, we talked about those tactics for capturing the emails, we even talked about, you know, some tactics of sort of baseline segmentation and all of that’s important again, to talk about the automation process and content relevancy. It’s, you know, it’s just an important piece. And so now we’re gonna end up…end up. We’re going to talk about, we’re gonna transition to specifically, you know, some best practices that you can use with Emma and Kurate, that hopefully will help sort of spark some ideas of ways that you can streamline these processes for your own site and in nurturing and making more money.

John: Excellent.

Jamie: So, let’s take a look. So, take it away, John.

John: Sure. So, Kurate is a WordPress plugin, you will install it on your WordPress site, you’ll activate it just like any other plugin you have. What it does is it allows you to connect to any Emma audience or segment so you can set up emails to be sent to your audience or segment automatically so that you can set it up once and forget it. This is a good screenshot of just kind of like, this will be what we call a stream of emails that are going out and tells you the day, it tells you when it’s going in. But like I said, you just set this up once and you don’t ever have to worry about it again. We’ve got right now currently around a million emails a month are going out using Kurate which is really cool.

Jamie: Which is really cool.

John: We had like one of our larger customers like they set this up. They went off for Christmas, they came back and then all their emails have been sent out.

Jamie: And the wheel didn’t fall off, yeah. Well, and you know, and I think aside from the convenience factor you know there is that point that I made earlier of we’re busy, we’re trying to figure out our paid ad spend and our website conversions and all this kind of stuff. Automating this process is better for the marketer but it’s also great for the user on the other side of it and that’s because you can create these categories, right?

John: Right, yes. So you can, basically what you do is you, on the Kurate end, on the WordPress and you’ve got categories, so in Kurate, you can go in and say what audience you want and then you can say what categories from your WordPress site, from your WordPress post you want to include in the email and then you can select the number of post.

Jamie: That’s great. And then what do we do here?

John: You can edit and preview it, so you can just look at the email just make sure it’s all right the first time, scroll through it, make sure all the colors are right, all that kind of good stuff.

Jamie: And so you guys kind of walk through it a little bit more. Are you guys creating the template like, what does that process look like for actual email creation because it’s happening on your end, correct?

John: Sure, yes. It actually happens within WordPress so we have what we call an email template customizer, we’ve got a slide here, in a second that’ll show you the backend of that, but it allows you to go in and change all the colors. So we don’t actually have a whole bunch of different templates for you to choose from there. It’s one template but you can customize the colors on that template and the templates built with email best practices actually from Emma server.

Jamie: Yeah, absolutely. And that was…kind of be my…and we’ll sort of look at a few of those here in a moment as well.

John: So you can…It mimics the Emma backend, so you can do everything from selecting what day of the week you want to send it on, what time you wanted to send it out, you can specify the subject, the preheader text, and you can do that what we call in the stream level which is kind of like your template level or if you want to change it per email, you can open it up and do it per email.

Jamie: And, you know, we talked about best practices, you know, something that’s really important to point out as well is that, you know, we have the subject, we have the pre-header text, the pre-header text, more than I guess, 60% almost of your audience is viewing your email first on a mobile device. So the template that John’s referencing that’s all mobile optimized, and we’ll sort of chat through some best practices there for a number of factors. But that pre-header text is important to point out and I think it’s really cool that you’re able to customize it. That’s essentially for those of you who may not know that sort of grayed out text underneath the subject line and the from name and the subject line. You know, those are vitally important everyone knows to kind of test those but a lot of times people will sort of forget about your pre-header text area and we definitely want to drive home that’s about 32 extra characters that you have to drive home added value. You can be a little bit more clever and concise with your subject line. So you definitely don’t want to forget that bit and I love that that’s included there. So I schedule my email it’s going out.

John: There’s…this is what I kind of talked about earlier, the actual customization of the email template, right? Being able to change like I said pretty much every color so you can match your brand when it sends out.

Jamie: Exactly. And one thing to piggyback on the preheader text thing, that view online bit there you know that’s showing up at the top that’s awesome it’s super convenient and if you know edit that preheader text you can kind of override you know, it’s something showing up by default that says like, “Can’t view this email online? Click here,” you know, so that’s pretty cool.

John: One other big features we have, you have the ability to add ads, these are all self-hosted ads which means they are images that live within your WordPress site, so you can add those to the top of the email, to the bottom of the email or both. So that once you’ve segmented your list, you can easily sell advertisements, right?

And you can…all these are measurable within your Emma response data. And that’s another thing I would have mentioned that since this actually sends out through Emma’s send API, which means that all the response data will show up in Emma. So everything in Kurate will happen in WordPress but all the response data happens in Emma. So, that if you’re just sending…if you wanna send these out, you don’t really have to do anything within your Emma backend. This is all done within WordPress.

Jamie: Exactly. And, you know, using your data to make those smart decisions and iterate, you know, while you can set it and forget it, it is going to be a good idea to get in there and look at your response data and make some smart decisions. And so the end of this presentation will actually look at an example of combining advertisements and using that data to make a really nice sort of design and content decision. So, I think that’s a good point.

John: So, use cases. How about it?

Jamie: Yeah, I like them. Go ahead.

John: So, sure. So this is a classic like signup form, this could be a pop-up, it could be on the side of your blog, you know, asking someone for an email and then how often they want to be communicated with. Whether that be on a daily basis or on a weekly basis, you’re able to go in the backend of Kurate and select that frequency. So, that you don’t have to worry about like hitting people up too much or not enough. They’re able to make that selection for you. And this just ties in with your Emma groups.

Jamie: Absolutely. And I would definitely say you know, we get the question often, actually, I saw it just come in a few moments ago. So we will address sort of some frequency sending questions. But this sneak peek is one of the best ways you know, again, we talked about content relevancy. It’s not just what the emails say, this is truly a huge piece of it, you know, the consumer or the audience member, the power is in the people’s hands, not necessarily the brand’s hand so I think tools like this that help you scale it and give that power to your recipients is pretty fantastic. And then this happens. Yeah, so I sign up, I say, “I want to receive emails weekly,” That’s all well and good. And we’ll sort of look at what that looks like. But really briefly, I wanna step in and chat a little bit about an aspect of automating these processes that is often overlooked.

There is a stat floating around out there that says that if, you know, a welcome note, so really that sort of automated first touch can actually increase long-term brand engagement by as much as 33%. Also, it’s somewhere in the ballpark of 70% to 80% of your new subscribers say that, they are expecting to receive some sort of communication right out of the gate. And it makes sense, I mean, I actually signed up for a list yesterday and immediately went you know, to my Gmail account this was totally you know, on a personal level, and I didn’t get anything thing, I didn’t get any sort of message from them.

And, you know, it’s one thing if I’m downloading a piece of content, obviously, you should send that immediately. But you definitely don’t want to overlook this. This is one of the most clicked through interactions that you will ever have, the average open rate for these welcome emails or email, the first one somewhere can be, you know, can be around 50%. So you have this incredible opportunity to make a very big lasting brand impression. And people often ask about this sort of template and, you know, a welcome note is all well and good but a series is actually even better.

And, you know, you can use the forums to gather people’s information but we do want to caution you know, outside of some very basic, you know, maybe location data or that frequency data. You do usually want to avoid having too many fields on a pop-up forum. So this welcome series is a fantastic place honestly to get me clicking to tell me why I should care about your brand, to tell me like, this third email based on you know, if I click on Bath and Body or if I click on retail, you’re gonna learn a lot more on the backend in your response data about my level of engagement with your brand, and you can actually use the sequence of emails to segment me into audiences that actually matter.

And better yet, all you need is one piece of data, you need an email address to make a really impactful, bold call to action. And, you know, right out of the gate, you don’t want to ask people to buy something typically. So a cadence like this is a really nice way so by the third or fourth date with your brand and the inbox and you can ask me, “Hey, I actually want you to take a demo, I actually want you to really buy these products and so on and so forth.” And so it’s just a really good reminder to, you know, increase your chances of making a sale with some intelligent touch points here. So, I created my sequence here it goes.

John: So, we’ve got subscribers, we’ve said hello. Now what do we do?

Jamie: Now, what do we do?

John: Let’s nurture them, right? Let’s nurture them.

Jamie: Let’s nurture them. Let’s continually nurture them.

John: Right. So, this is the backend, a screenshot of the backend of Kurate. I’ve shown you can create the stream name as just the daily stream, it’s connecting to your blog subscribers, right the people who came in through your signup form, it’s gonna send the categories of news or Nashville or whatever you want what from your WordPress site. It’s gonna have the latest two post and it’s gonna send on Monday and Tuesday at 7:30 in the morning. So, those subscribers know you know this was the daily emails sending out Monday, Tuesday, you obviously you can do it Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, whatever you want.

Jamie: Whenever you want. And, you know, and I also saw this question come in because it’s, I feel like at this point, I know the ones that are gonna come in. And you know, people always ask about frequency and time of day. So we’ll dig into this a little bit later. But obviously, this is something you can edit all the time if needed. So, all right.

John: So this is kind of, that’s kind of like, step one right? The first use case was a frequency, the second one’s more of a content and this goes a lot more into segmentation so like this kind of goes back to the style blueprint example, right? Someone gives you your email I’m interested in with an interest in you have like news and deals and clothing or whatever it might be, whatever your WordPress categories or topics of conversation you might have, that they can choose, right? And then on the backend, those are all Emma groups, right? So, they’ll go into those Emma groups which then you can segment and then send out appropriate content too.

Jamie: Exactly. And again, you can welcome them and I would say too this is a great opportunity to perhaps mix up some content, change up you know, maybe you have a separate series where email three looks a little bit different based on you know, what they’ve indicated they’re interested in, you know, maybe based on those categories, news or clothing or deals you make sure you reflect that at this touch point. So that’s something that you can do to play around or keep it the same. And then…

John: And then, I think this is another power play for you to write because you’ve segmented your groups. You can see the Emma audience then ads, people who want news and deals and clothing segment, right? So then you can also sell ads, right? Because you can go to your advertising partners and say, I know this is what these people want, you can use our ad feature then to target them with other information.

Jamie: Exactly. And this is just…

John: Here’s a great example, right? This is one of our customers, Music Business Association. They’ve got their ad zone up there at the top. They’ve also got one at the bottom. And the ads can go as high as you want. The width is like 650, which is standard for you guys…

Jamie: Yeah, perfect. And you know, placement of those ads it’s nice to know that those are something that you can always test and play around with. Because the placement of those ads is something you know that email data can be super invaluable to helping you sell those ads, so here’s an example from a customer of ours called Garden and Gun, they’re a publisher of their magazine. And obviously selling advertisements specifically for publishers or blogger’s is a huge huge way to ensure you know kind of continual lasting revenue.

So the thing that’s really interesting about Garden & Gun is that you know, they are really a southern lifestyle magazine, I don’t know how many of you are familiar with them, but, you know, they send out recipes they send out, you know, all kinds of all manner of different topics that they know that their subscribers enjoy and like. And, you know, they tested many different formats, you know, sometimes they would put the cocktail recipes at the top, sometimes they would put, you know, visit Charleston or something like that. And after a while they actually started to dig in, to dig into the data and in Emma you actually can see a click map of your activity.

And so low and bold they got into one of their mailings, and they looked down and they saw that anytime they had a cocktail recipe, so what you see here on the left is the top of the mailing, the right, just the continuation. So, it’s top and bottom, here left and right, they were able to indicate that over the course of time, anytime they had a cocktail recipe at the bottom of the mailing, it would get the most clicks. The cocktail recipe could be at the top of the mailing, it could be at the bottom, it could be in the middle. But if it were at the bottom, they could actually ensure that someone was going to scroll all the way down. People get these mailings now, and they want that whiskey punch recipe, they’re expecting the Kentucky Derby you know, cocktail recipes.

And so, by placing advertising or selling advertising alongside those cocktail recipes, they’re actually able to ensure that those people are going to get an impression because what they can do is they can actually pull up their data and show that, yeah, people did click on the wreath, people did click on these earrings. But the majority of people clicked on the whiskey punch. And I don’t blame them because it looks delicious. And as you can see too they put their own advertisement, their own subscription sort of ad down there at the bottom as well. And they probably wouldn’t do that if they didn’t think that people were clicking all the way down to the bottom.

So when you think about placement, when you think about where to play with it, you know, as he was saying, you can put it at the top, you can put at the bottom. But in order to actually sell this to advertisers, you know, make sure that you’re checking your response data. Same thing with send time, because at the end of the day, again, it’s all about content relevancy, it’s all about what matters to your readers. You may think going into this that everybody wants, you know, I know these women who want to know about these recipes. And really what they want to know about is having a fun craft cocktail just like the rest of us, we’re all created equal. So, that’s it short, sweet to have anything to add, John?

John: I would just say like, this is…today we’ve gone through like, Kurate what I call out of the box, but Kurate we’ve got a customized version where we can do any design, we can put ads anywhere you wanna, we can take content from any portion of your website as long as it’s WordPress and send it through Emma. I just wanted to throw that little plug in there.

Jamie: Very nice and speaking of little plugs.

John: Oh, look at that? Speaking of that.

Jamie: If you’re are an Emma customer, if you are a WordPress user and you are not yet familiar with Kurate checkout,, and you actually get 20% off for life.

John: For life.

Jamie: Wow.

John: Only till Wednesday.

Jamie: Until Wednesday. So, get 20% off for life but it expires on Wednesday for the rest of your life. Okay, got it and use the promo code EMMAWEB you can also just email questions to And now we’re gonna happen to questions, I’m just gonna leave this up here. I actually have a cute Q&A slide but it’s not nearly as cute as a promo code. So I’m gonna leave it up. So we did get a lot of good questions and we won’t keep you much longer. But if you do think of something while we’re chatting, just let us know.

And right out of the gate, I am going to go ahead and address the best time of day to send an email and I’d love your thoughts on it. But I mean, my philosophy and this is gonna sound a little easy of an answer is the best time of day to send an email is when people are opening, most likely to open your email. And what we mean by that is actually looking at the data you know as John showed you, you can set it to go out at 7:30 in the morning on Tuesday and Wednesday. You have to start somewhere and you can start somewhere and make improvements with data. It doesn’t hurt you know, I think the sort of going rate just for general time of day to send if you have no idea you have no data you do not know anything about your audience you know, it’s Tuesday through Thursday sometime between 10 and 2 people are probably awake, people are probably functioning they might be checking email. That is the most high-level basic answer.

The second answer is, you know, when are your competitors sending email. If everyone in your space is sending email at 6 a.m on a Monday, you don’t wanna send email at 6 a.m on a Monday. If everyone starts sending on Saturday and that’s when you were sending, you know this answer is going to shift and change depending on what’s happening and what you’re seeing yourself.

John: I would say, I mean I definitely agree with that, I’ll also say like in the publishing world I think early morning is best. You’re gonna notice that like, you get your New York Times first thing in the morning, I get like something called the Scheme every morning like before, like when I’m sitting there in bed I’m getting ready to get out like, it’s there for me to know what’s going on. So like, I think if that’s what you’re using Kurate for those especially are good to like early morning the better.

Jamie: That’s fantastic and also you know, I think that then for you maybe it is the day of the week if you are sending a weekly Digest maybe that’s the lever you pull you know if it’s if everyone’s sending at 6 a.m date obviously if you’re sending a daily newsletter, you need…I think that’s the other thing and kind of transitions to a frequency sort of, actually someone else asked how frequent should you send marketing emails, Robbie wants to know. You know, those answers go hand in hand when it comes to frequency. Obviously, if you set an expectation that you’re gonna send daily, you have to send daily and honestly…

John: And it’s automatic.

Jamie: Right, tools like this. And, you know, I would say I’ve been…you and I both have been working with clients and with email marketing for some time and marketers for some time and you know, these tools haven’t always existed. I mean, this is…one reason we’re even talking about automation so confidently, not just because that’s what Kurate does, but it’s because it’s possible in so many areas of your life, it’s the expectation on the other end for consumers. So that daily cadence, that daily email that’s not, you know, prohibitive anymore to a small business owner. It’s really scalable with all that technology, but the burden of that is that it’s also now the going expectation that it’s totally possible.

So, yeah, so frequency of sending if you are just sending you know, we have talked a lot about relevancy and automation but if you are gonna send you know, you still can send a monthly newsletter, you still can send up a batch and blast mailing you know, we…you know, hyper segment certain mailings that we send out, you know, we were more targeted about this invitation because we wanted to make sure it was relevant to people that might be…

John: Yeah, I think that’s very, very key is that, there are Emma emails in Kurate emails. Kurate is really good at things automatically from content on your WordPress site. It’s not good if you’re sending a one-off. That’s what you use Emma for.

Jamie: Sure. And you know and those sort of tools all work in concert together. Same thing you know, when we looked at those pop-ups earlier, a lightbox form is fantastic it performs that doesn’t necessarily mean that you abandon that static forum that’s also anchored and lives at the footer of your homepage. Email doesn’t live in a vacuum, forms don’t live in a vacuum, automation and sort of emails that can nurture a wider audience all of these things sort of work together to create the total package of getting people on the door. But you know, again, broken record it’s always about your audience and your data. You know, there are some sort of best practices in publishing that I’m sure we’ll uncover. Is there would you say that there are any trends with like a weekly send or a daily send? What do you see more often out there?

John: I think it just depends on how much content you’re creating, so like, I get one and it’s like the top five you know, things in tech news for the week. Well, that’s a great like thing I get on Saturday, right? So, I can kind of review what I missed, right, but if I want every morning to like know what’s going on last night or that morning, right, then that’s more of…it just kind of depends on how much content and what type of content if you’re producing just a ton of content or just a targeted amount of content.

Jamie: What would you say you know obviously, this helps publishers scale but what is sort of the average team size that you see your work with? Is it pretty bare bones?

John: Most publishers you know, you’ve got a content creator, you’ve got a marketing person, you’ve got social person may be so like four or five.

Jamie: Yeah, pretty lean.

John: They’re sending out a million a month. So, you know, but this is really a very small part of their day now, like they don’t have to worry about copying and pasting in their Emma. You know, this opens Emma up to be used by lots of publishers or anyone who’s creating large amounts of content that they wanna be able…in WordPress that they want to get out. So, that’s kind of a market differentiator even for Emma because with using your Send API it just opens a whole lot of opportunities up for different content creators around.

Jamie: That’s fantastic. We have a question from Nicole and it’s about design, which is my favorite bit of email. And, you know, we sort of touched on that in the final example, you know, the placement of where you place ads or where you place calls to action. To me always those should tie back again to what is the response. However, if you’re just getting started if you’re unsure, you know, having…you know, there’s sort of some general rules of thumb. So Nicole’s specific question is actually about animated gifts. But I do want to take the time to kind of point out sort of just general best practices for design and for high converting emails that do convert.

So you know, with that Garden & Gun good example, let me go back on it just for one second here. So they’re doing a lot of things really well they’re actually doing some things that on paper are not necessarily always best practice, but I’ll kind of talk through that. So what you see here, first and foremost, you know, I touched on subject lines, I talked about preheader text, the majority of your audience if you can get them to open that email with a compelling subject line that sounds you know, personal and exclusive, the majority of your audience is still merely scanning your email. So when we talk about building a template with best practices in mind, what we really mean is making sure that right out of the gate it’s apparent the branding is there at the top.

Also that there’s an anchoring sort of hero image. There’s something visually that sets this mailing apart that captures my attention. Fun Facts, they have a lot of stuff on their side because our brains love pictures of food because we’re cavemen. And so that is actually true. We also apparently love drinking, but, you know, they almost always have some sort of delicious thing here at the top, it captures your attention. And then from there, people are merely scanning. So you want to make sure that no matter what you’re asking me to do, it’s really easy for me to see a headline, those links that they’re using…

John: Here and here.

Jamie: Yeah, exactly. They stick out, they’re visually contracting with the background. One thing that we do typically recommend for mobile audiences is that you do wanna air on the side of having graphics that look more like a button and which is what they’re doing at the bottom of these mailings, even though they’re little square images. That’s kind of button like that’s easy to tap on a mobile device, it is a lot easier to interact with than a text link. So you do wanna be careful that you have a good mixture of calls to action that are easy to just interact with. Apple actually found the average surface area of the human fingertip is 44 by 44 pixels squared. I have that memorized. So, you know, anything smaller than that it’s going to be really hard for people to interact with it.

So, you know, when we talk about design, we talk about things converting, it’s not just the offer that you’re giving, it’s actually is this something…is it clear what the value proposition is and they actually have a lot of text, but and I will say we have probably a lot of publishers on the line, you’re in luck because your audiences probably read more than the normal audience.

A retail email is going to be much less wordy and we would recommend that. The publishers actually get to play around with the amount of content in their email and that’s actually really fun. So people actually might read your emails, guys and I can’t say that of most people on the line are out there in our world so. And when it comes to GIFs I would say if you do want some movement like I mentioned we love food, we also love just stuff moving because we’re cavemen. We’ve lived…

John. We love animated cat GIFs.

Jamie: We do?

John: If it’s not an animated cat GIF we’re walking.

Jamie: But animated GIFs you know, they work and they’re prevalent and they’re popular because they actually draw your eye, they draw attention and the best part is that they work for almost every single recipient with the exception of some people viewing In some versions of Outlook but you can…

John: Thanks to Microsoft.

Jamie: But my point on GIFs is, huge fan of GIFs, they actually skyrocket click-through as you can see, you know, 100% to 200% click-through rate sometimes with a GIF. Same thing if that gift is representing a video if you have video content, and you want an animated GIF image representing that video and want to get somebody to watch something on your blog there. It’s a fantastic use of that format or just cats or whatever you want. But it’s a cool way to sort of consolidate visual information in a way that captures attention and gets people clicking.

John: So, can we go back to the cat GIF for…

Jamie: Yeah, please.

John: Sure. Just a little promo here, if you go at my site,, you go to the bottom in the footer, there’s a place for you to sign up for the latest updates. When you get that automated email that it comes there is a link to click on my favorite cat GIF.

Jamie: I…okay, you got me.

John: Now, you’re interested, aren’t you?

Jamie: I’m very interested. I think we don’t have any more questions that aren’t repeats. So one more question going once, going twice. Anything you wanna send us out on besides the cat GIF? That’s…

John: The cat GIF, go sign up to hear about the news.

Jamie: Phenomenal advice. So as he said, thank you so much, John.

John: Yeah: Thank for having me.

Jamie: This has been fantastic., 20% off for life until Wednesday with promo code EMMAWEB. And yeah, thank you so much.

John: Thank you.

Jamie: Yeah, and thank you, guys for being here.

Ready to do your best email marketing?

Request a tour

We use cookies to serve personalized content and targeted advertisements to you, which gives you a better browsing experience and lets us analyze site traffic. Review our cookie information to learn more. You can manage your cookie preferences at any time.